04 Sep, 2010, Deimos wrote in the 1st comment:
Votes: 0
I've been researching different implementations of bloodlines/inherited traits/ancestry/whatever-you-want-to-call-it, and found several interesting systems, but none that I've completely fallen in love with. So, I was just wondering if any of you have such a system, or even ideas for one that haven't come to fruition yet, that you'd like to share and/or brainstorm about.

First, let me start by setting the scope. I'm trying to come up with a system whereby players can have a "family tree" of sorts, without actually requiring the "family" part. That is to say, I don't believe it's necessary to model the parent/offspring relationship. For games with vampires and werewolves, it's easy to model this, as the bloodline isn't determined by offspring, but rather, the chain of infection (or whatever you want to call it). The general idea is that the more players a bloodline has, the stronger its effects become. I'd rather stay away from the pyramid-scheme structure, whereby the origin of the bloodline is stronger than his descendants, who, in turn, are stronger than their own descendants, and so on. This is riddled with problems that I don't really feel are worth the effort to mitigate (but feel free to describe any such system you may have had success with, and how you addressed the problems, if you like).

The main thing I'd like to see is the thematic explanation - in other words, how do you explain the concept of a bloodline without incorporating reproduction? Is it by being part of a clan/guild? Is it purely magical? Etc. Also, there are several problems with allowing the power of a bloodline to grow based on the number of members - how do you address alternate characters created solely to buff the bloodline, or how to you prevent one bloodline from completely overwhelming the game? The actual buffs themselves aren't really important, as they depend almost completely on the actual game, so feel free to leave those out unless you find them particularly interesting or relevant in some other way.
04 Sep, 2010, Ssolvarain wrote in the 2nd comment:
Votes: 0
"how to you prevent one bloodline from completely overwhelming the game?"

If the power of a blood line is kept in check by an upkeep, with each individual vampire's age determining how much it can contribute, it should limit the number of vampires.

check this out:
Each vampire has to play (or do?) so much in order to raise their own contribution to the blood line as a whole. If a bloodline's power is based on the total contribution vs. total members, it would create a system where each new player would actually weaken a blood line until they came into their full power. If each player can only supply 1 1/4 times their own upkeep cost, it would help newer players along while still keeping a nice even ratio.

Thematically… you could pass this off as blood tribute to a deity. Or a treated blood that stimulates the vampire's mind and body. Lot of ways to give a thematic explanation. When in doubt, make it sound good even if there are no facts to support it.
04 Sep, 2010, Deimos wrote in the 3rd comment:
Votes: 0
Ssolvarain said:
check this out:
Each vampire has to play (or do?) so much in order to raise their own contribution to the blood line as a whole. If a bloodline's power is based on the total contribution vs. total members, it would create a system where each new player would actually weaken a blood line until they came into their full power. If each player can only supply 1 1/4 times their own upkeep cost, it would help newer players along while still keeping a nice even ratio.

I saw something similar to this before, in which a player's "contribution" to the strength of the bloodline was directly related to his age. I guess the assumption there was that older players are more powerful. While this makes sense for vampires, it doesn't really make sense for many other themes (and my game isn't vampire-related - I only used that as an example in my OP). It's also subject to obvious abuse: assuming your game, like most, keeps time independent of who is online, a character's age will continue to go up even while not playing (and so to, their bloodline's strength).

It could be altered so that, rather than using age, it used "play time", but then you're left with how to calculate what counts as "playing", and if you're too liberal, you could wind up with people increasing the strength of their bloodline just by leaving their characters online and/or doing some menial action on scripted timers while not actually playing. This could be chalked up to botting and subject to punishment for breaking rules, but, in general, the less you have to rely on manual enforcement of rules, the better. Also, this concept of "play time" or in-game actions increasing bloodline strength kind of goes against the idea of a bloodline to begin with - which is to say, bloodlines are supposed to be relatively passive.

I guess it's important to emphasize that, even though I keep referring to bloodlines, I'm not tied to that explicit type of system, and I'm only using it for brevity's sake, to explain a broader concept. I'm open to any kind of system that offers passive bonuses to its members that fluctuate based on the number and/or strength of its other members and can be explained in a thematically cool and logical way. Another idea I've toyed around with is that of religion. Obviously this has nothing to do with "bloodlines", but it could still be the kind of system I'm looking for. More members = stronger bonuses. Bonuses are passive. It can be explained in an intriguing way (for example, maybe followers of Zeus get +1 lightning resistance for every member following him).
05 Sep, 2010, Rudha wrote in the 4th comment:
Votes: 0
The idea of religion is one that could have the limitations and restrictions explained in a more in-role way. It could be argued or explained that the collective faith of more individuals allows each individual member to be stronger then they were individually. This would make sense for both parties in the transaction; the gods would have religious orders or knighthoods or whatever whom were encouraged by that to work together whereas the players would receive the actual benefit provided they are part of the organisation.

If you have a system where there is some sort of rank or level progression, you could also have different, or more powerful effects, at different steps in the progression. This would encourage people to actively take part in the organisation rather than just joining for the 'perks', however it does tend to have a bit of a downside in that in my experience it leads to some drama as people struggle with requirements for advancement. On the weight of that alone I wouldn't toss the idea; however it still must be considered.

Also, it is worth also considering that there will inevitably be people who would not want to be fettered by such a system in spite of the 'carrot' dangling of rewards, you should consider whether you want them to be penalised for that or not, both in not receiving the bonuses, and further penalties if you really wanted to emphasise it. Personally I find that in games where there are strong organisational ties, there tends to be enough of a social stigma against those who aren't part of the group, as it were, that that along with the bonuses you do not receive tends to be enough deterrent.

As regards what bonuses I would consider; something I'm doing on my MUD is the idea of having a spirituality skillset, wherein the actual skills are different from deity to deity. If you wanted varieties in your bonuses, you could have them be thematic in some way. There are obvious tie ins, ie sky god follower gets lightning powers, fire god follower gets fire powers, etc, but as to specific suggestions that depends on the lore of the world, really - and how deeply mired you want to have the gods in the game.

I'm starting to ramble a bit here so I'll end it at that, but hopefully I've given some food for thought.

Maya/Rudha
05 Sep, 2010, quixadhal wrote in the 5th comment:
Votes: 0
My own game (named, cleverly enough, WileyMUD IV: Bloodlines) will be using bloodlines as ancestral ties to various powerful groups in the game's past. As a player, you won't be born into any of these families, but you will be working for (and against) them as you progress. It's possible to be adopted into a faction if you make them happy enough, although I'm not set on the details of how I want that to work yet.

Rather than some kind of magical reward for belonging to a certain faction, I'd prefer to keep the rewards in the form of quests that are only available to each family, access to shops and retainers, the ability to walk into certain places and not be KOS.

WileyMUD III was a more-or-less straight up "low fantasy" game, and whenever I feel like sitting down to work on IV, it will shift even further towards medieval, but I'll still keep the magic and orcs. :)

As for preventing a single faction from gaining the upper hand.. if you tie NPC structures into it, that's easily controlled by the game developers. Too many players joining the Fluffy Hand of Happiness faction? Fine. Beef up the strength and numbers for the Smelly Orcs of Footrot and the Naughty Smurf Red-light District, so they start beating down the FHoH NPC infrastructure, and members of the FHoH will have a tough time setting foot outside the city without being in a nice fat warband.
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