04 Jul, 2010, Hakuten wrote in the 1st comment:
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hey ive been an exceptional builder for years and was thinkin about dabling with coding. I use windows seven and dont want to pay for a server as i dont have my own functional mud, so i plan to use my comp. howver i was wondering what codebase would be best suited for learning amd would run best for me???
04 Jul, 2010, Runter wrote in the 2nd comment:
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The first thing you need to do is decide if you want to really learn to program or to dabble. Learning to program is a long process, but it can be a matter of weeks to get most of the language of your choice if you're really diligent every day.

What works for me is reading a little bit, applying it immediately from memory, and continuing in the reading material. What doesn't work for me is reading straight through material and trying to apply it later. I've had some success with books and online materials. Everyone learns differently, but ultimately lectures for me haven't been as effective except for turning me on to concepts and ideas to explore on my own.
04 Jul, 2010, Hakuten wrote in the 3rd comment:
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i want to learn, cuz im tired of building entire worlds for muds and then nothing ever happening with the muds lol. ive downloaded the newest smaugfuss file and cygwin just tryin to get it to compile now
04 Jul, 2010, Runter wrote in the 4th comment:
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Starting with a relatively big application like this isn't the best way to learn. This would be what I meant by dabble. :)
04 Jul, 2010, Hakuten wrote in the 5th comment:
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lol im just tryin to learn and dont exactly have much to go on cept forums and helpfiles, since i dont have a functional mud to code on, thus i wanted to get one up of my own, not public just something to go with and learn, cuz im a read and do kind of learner, i have to do it as i read it to understand it.
04 Jul, 2010, Idealiad wrote in the 6th comment:
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Smaug is a good choice I think, perhaps tba Circle and Quickmud would be others if you want a full game.

Dead Souls is a good option too, and if you want something more barebones perhaps NakedMUD.

You also could find a free test server without too much trouble I think, and the experience of working on a remote server would be valuable to have.
04 Jul, 2010, Hakuten wrote in the 7th comment:
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ok i have smaugfuss1.9, and cgywin, how do i get it to compile sice the gcc is included with the smaugfuss download, or so it says…? i cant seem to find any legitimate example through search that seem to be right
04 Jul, 2010, Kline wrote in the 8th comment:
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Idealiad said:
You also could find a free test server without too much trouble I think, and the experience of working on a remote server would be valuable to have.


I'm pondering offering free space on a VPS I have for people willing to tinker with the latest builds of AckFUSS there. I really need people to try and mutilate and break the poor thing, and kinda not-so-secretly hope the idea would spur some interest :). Not to hijack the OP's question, but does anyone think this would be a viable idea? Offering free tinker/hosting space to people willing to do so with a certain base, in hopes of getting more of a community to generate? Kinda like the free food samples at Sam's to entice you to buy the product…
04 Jul, 2010, Hakuten wrote in the 9th comment:
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well depepnding on what u could do with ackmud, id probebly be willing to try it, my final goal is basically to create a mud with a leveless system, unique player killing, and role playing, and all completely original areas, as far as what subject, i havent made up my mind, i loved dbz muds in the day, but they have died now it seems, and ive always loved anima and final fantasy games, *shrug*, problem is without someone to kinda help guide me through the basics, i think im in for a lonnnng trip
04 Jul, 2010, Hakuten wrote in the 10th comment:
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wierd so far everything in the example is right except the make command, says there is no make command in cygwin. ugh
04 Jul, 2010, Tyche wrote in the 11th comment:
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Hakuten said:
wierd so far everything in the example is right except the make command, says there is no make command in cygwin. ugh


Cygwin doesn't install the developer tools by default. Run cygwin setup.exe again and pick the packages you'll need. gcc and make will be two of them for sure.
04 Jul, 2010, Idealiad wrote in the 12th comment:
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@Kline, I like that idea, does Ack have IMC or something like that built-in? Seems like it would be good for a setup like that.
04 Jul, 2010, Kline wrote in the 13th comment:
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Yeah, it ships with the Freedom client installed. Dunno if I'd feel up to the hassle of creating a separate IMC network for it to auto-connect to or just leave it for people to pick one of the existing ones.
05 Jul, 2010, JohnnyStarr wrote in the 14th comment:
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Hakuten, I think it's great that you want to run your own mud now. A large codebase will work well to get your mud
started, but if you have zero programming experience, I wouldn't plan on being able to make any major modifications for at least a year.
I started learning C about 2 years ago, and C++ about 1 year ago. And I'm just now capable of doing just about whatever I want. The thing is
that I had several years of Visual Basic under my belt. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to discourage you.

If you are going to hit the ground running with any Diku based mud, I strongly recommend learning as much C as you can. And like Runter pointed
out, dabbling with SMAUG might be adding properties to objects, or tweaking color codes, etc. But anything like refactoring sub systems or adding
new ones all together are going to be very long term for you. If you approach it from that angle though, you'll stick it out, and when you get there it's sweet!
Best regards!
05 Jul, 2010, Hakuten wrote in the 15th comment:
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thanx, i dont have enough time with a newborn here to really learn it all at once, hence why i said dabble, i eventually want to be a full fledged coder, and i know it will take a while, but then im a patiant man, and determined so im sure i can do it
05 Jul, 2010, Parhelion wrote in the 16th comment:
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Well, I'm going to get flamed hard-core for this, but…

Are you interested in coding because you want to open a new MUD, or are you interested in opening a new MUD because you want to learn to code?

I guess I'm going to be there downer here and say that unless you know even a smidgeon about good game design, writing, or game administration - not just building a mass collection of areas, as anyone who can spell can accomplish that - you probably shouldn't be trying to open up a new game. It is a heavy investment, not just in terms of time and passion, but also in money! If you want to learn to program with MUDs, I suggest finding a mentor on a game where you have a good reputation as a trustworthy builder and working your way up. In doing this, you can increase the quality of your favorite game, and the overall community.

If your interest is to just learn to program, I highly recommend starting with a project that is a lot smaller than a MUD. Once you dive in, it can be really confusing if you don't have a good foundation.

I think it's a fair assertion that the stock-mud start-ups overrunning the MUDverse are just gettin' old. And no, just because you ripped out Midgaard, it doesn't make you original. :x

(Flame away.)
05 Jul, 2010, Hakuten wrote in the 17th comment:
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im surprised it took that long for someone to ask that. and no actually i dont really got the time it would take to learn code and run a new mud that could compete with other top muds, and im not one that likes to trai behind in the dust either. my interest is to learn code, and that is my whole reason for even dl smaug to play with code, so i wont mess up someone else's game lol
05 Jul, 2010, Parhelion wrote in the 18th comment:
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Hakuten said:
im surprised it took that long for someone to ask that. and no actually i dont really got the time it would take to learn code and run a new mud that could compete with other top muds, and im not one that likes to trai behind in the dust either. my interest is to learn code, and that is my whole reason for even dl smaug to play with code, so i wont mess up someone else's game lol


I'm standing firm in my suggestion, then, to step back and look into a smaller project – at least until you get a foundation of knowledge built up. While you may not be working directly with a MUD, the upside to this is that by taking smaller steps you'll be able to see yourself making more progress and it's easier to learn.

The most often-used language in MUDs is C, but C can be difficult to swallow for a non-programmer. I'd just doing minor tutorials first or checking out a library book on general programming and logic (this will help you no matter what language you eventually choose to work with).
06 Jul, 2010, Hakuten wrote in the 19th comment:
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what would you suggest as far as a smaller project??
06 Jul, 2010, David Haley wrote in the 20th comment:
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Tic-tac-toe is a pretty good small project. You can move from there to something like the Snake/Centipede game (the one where you grow longer as you get points) because it is real-time. When you want to do networking, you can start with a simple chat room type thing.

Any number of books have tutorials along the way with small tasks you can complete to exercise whatever the chapter just covered.

You can do homework assignments from universities, such as this course – also note the handouts they have available for download.
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