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<H1>[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</H1>
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<LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
<LI><em>Subject</em>: [MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</LI>
<LI><em>From</em>: Jo Dillon <<A HREF="mailto:emily#thelonious,new.ox.ac.uk">emily#thelonious,new.ox.ac.uk</A>></LI>
<LI><em>Date</em>: Fri, 18 Dec 1998 11:02:33 +0000</LI>
<LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
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<PRE>
Caliban Tiresias Darklock (caliban#darklock,com) spake thusly:
> I said:
> > Hmm. a) surely you mean TCP/IP? Telnet is a protocol on top of TCP/IP;
> >it just so happens that you can use a telnet client to talk to ftp,
> >http and so forth servers, but that doesn't mean they really speak telnet.
>
> They don't speak the options, certainly, but they do run over a telnet
> connection. While I have not read *all* of the RFCs in question, and don't
> feel like looking them up to confirm exactly where and what they explicitly
> say, many of them (I am tempted to say all, but I have to admit the
> possibility that one or more of them does not explicitly say this) actually
> say up front that they are constructed over a telnet connection -- with all
> the IAC negotiation that implies.
I stand corrected, though it still seems slightly odd to me.
>
> Seriously, boiling the internet down to one protocol is an exercise in
> futility. There are always significant parts which don't fit into that
> reduction. This is one of them. We certainly can't just chuck UDP out the
> window, but we can rather safely ignore it in many cases. Not all. Certainly
> not all.
True - though I'd be tempted to build some types of mud client out of it.
>
> > Why not write a cross-platform client in something like wxWindows?
>
> I am not a fan of cross-platform, but this is basically prejudice. A user
> interface guru once said that if you want a Windows app, build a Windows
> app, and Windows users will like it. If you want a Mac app, build a Mac app,
> and Mac users will like it. If you try to do both at once, you will really
> not be doing either, and it will just make both groups unhappy.
Well, the really cool way to fix this is to have a themeable look
and feel - so that the application can rearrange itself to look appropriate
for each platform according to a config file.
> > Java is /easier/ to set up as an applet.
>
> But you have to set it up *every* time, because you never know if the user
> has set it up before. You could use a cookie, but cookies are supposed to be
> Bad for some reason which always escapes me. And besides, users can refuse
> or delete or modify cookies. ;)
True. Using a signed applet lets you save configuration files, and of course
you can also suck them over the net (the applet I maintain for the company
I work for does both).
> I'm tempted to get into a language war here, because I absolutely hate Java.
> But instead, I'll allow that it may not be a *total* piece of garbage -- I
> just don't find that it suits my needs, ever. As a developer, as a user, it
> doesn't matter. Java has never been a reliable or acceptable solution for a
> native app in my experience. YMMV.
Actually, I tend to agree. It's ok for small dialogues and things but I
wouldn't want to do anything complicated in Java. I should know, I maintain
a 30,000 line applet which is horribly slow and has some graphics
glitches which are a nightmare to get rid of. That's why my preference
would be for a native-code cross-platform client :)
--
Jo
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<LI><STRONG><A NAME="00983" HREF="msg00983.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</A></STRONG>
<UL><LI><EM>From:</EM> "Caliban Tiresias Darklock" <caliban#darklock,com></LI></UL></LI>
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<ul><li>Thread context:
<BLOCKQUOTE><UL>
<LI><STRONG>[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01028" HREF="msg01028.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</A></strong>,
J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Mon 21 Dec 1998, 22:53 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01027" HREF="msg01027.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</A></strong>,
J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Mon 21 Dec 1998, 22:47 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01050" HREF="msg01050.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</A></strong>,
J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Thu 24 Dec 1998, 07:57 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00983" HREF="msg00983.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</A></strong>,
Caliban Tiresias Darklock <a href="mailto:caliban#darklock,com">caliban#darklock,com</a>, Thu 17 Dec 1998, 19:05 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00995" HREF="msg00995.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</A></strong>,
Jo Dillon <a href="mailto:emily#thelonious,new.ox.ac.uk">emily#thelonious,new.ox.ac.uk</a>, Fri 18 Dec 1998, 13:02 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="01000" HREF="msg01000.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</A></strong>,
Caliban Tiresias Darklock <a href="mailto:caliban#darklock,com">caliban#darklock,com</a>, Fri 18 Dec 1998, 21:21 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00978" HREF="msg00978.html">[MUD-Dev] Graphic design, client questions</A></strong>,
Thinus Barnard <a href="mailto:thinus_barnard#bigfoot,com">thinus_barnard#bigfoot,com</a>, Thu 17 Dec 1998, 08:50 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00989" HREF="msg00989.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Graphic design, client questions</A></strong>,
Ben Greear <a href="mailto:greear#cyberhighway,net">greear#cyberhighway,net</a>, Fri 18 Dec 1998, 00:52 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00970" HREF="msg00970.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: AFAP: As fast as possible, non linear...</A></strong>,
quzah [softhome] <a href="mailto:quzah#softhome,net">quzah#softhome,net</a>, Tue 15 Dec 1998, 12:30 GMT
</LI>
</UL></BLOCKQUOTE>
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