<!-- MHonArc v2.4.4 --> <!--X-Subject: Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list --> <!--X-From-R13: pynjerapNphc.uc.pbz --> <!--X-Date: from major.globecomm.net [207.51.48.5] by mx5.ibm.net id 862335482.97886-1 Tue Apr 29 17:38:02 1997 --> <!--X-Message-Id: 199704291742.KAA27726#xsvr3,cup.hp.com --> <!--X-Content-Type: text/plain --> <!--X-Reference: 199704270722.CAA25667@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com --> <!--X-Head-End--> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> <html> <head> <title>MUD-Dev message, Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</title> <!-- meta name="robots" content="noindex,nofollow" --> <link rev="made" href="mailto:clawrenc#cup,hp.com"> </head> <body background="/backgrounds/paperback.gif" bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000" link="#0000FF" alink="#FF0000" vlink="#006000"> <font size="+4" color="#804040"> <strong><em>MUD-Dev<br>mailing list archive</em></strong> </font> <br> [ <a href="../">Other Periods</a> | <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a> | <a href="/search.php3">Search</a> ] <br clear=all><hr> <!--X-Body-Begin--> <!--X-User-Header--> <!--X-User-Header-End--> <!--X-TopPNI--> Date: [ <a href="msg00286.html">Previous</a> | <a href="msg00288.html">Next</a> ] Thread: [ <a href="msg00254.html">Previous</a> | <a href="msg00277.html">Next</a> ] Index: [ <A HREF="author.html#00287">Author</A> | <A HREF="#00287">Date</A> | <A HREF="thread.html#00287">Thread</A> ] <!--X-TopPNI-End--> <!--X-MsgBody--> <!--X-Subject-Header-Begin--> <H1>Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</H1> <HR> <!--X-Subject-Header-End--> <!--X-Head-of-Message--> <UL> <LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#null,net">mud-dev#null,net</A></LI> <LI><em>Subject</em>: Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</LI> <LI><em>From</em>: <A HREF="mailto:clawrenc#cup,hp.com">clawrenc#cup,hp.com</A></LI> <LI><em>Date</em>: Mon, 28 Apr 97 10:28:00 -0700</LI> <LI><em>Reply-to</em>: <A HREF="mailto:claw#null,net">claw#null,net</A></LI> </UL> <!--X-Head-of-Message-End--> <!--X-Head-Body-Sep-Begin--> <HR> <!--X-Head-Body-Sep-End--> <!--X-Body-of-Message--> <PRE> In <<A HREF="msg00254.html">199704270722.CAA25667#dfw-ix7,ix.netcom.com</A>>, on 04/27/97 at 07:50 AM, "Jon A. Lambert" <jlsysinc#ix,netcom.com> said: >> From: clawrenc#cup,hp.com >> at 11:03 PM, "Jon A. Lambert" <jlsysinc#ix,netcom.com> said: >> >While I love the use of regular expressions in COLD, the enhancements >> >they have made to context are decidedly irritating. One's order of >> >verb processing can easily change by moving about the world and >> >picking up and dropping items. I prefer a consistent and fixed >> >context order. It makes for a more comfortable user interface. >> >> Mind detailing exactly what you like and dislike about their changes >> to the definition of context? (Been a while since I looked) >> >This is in the ColdX core. There is a dictionary called "context" >attached to the $user object. The command_parse searches this >dictionary for best(?) matches when one uses a verb that could be >used with multiple objects. For instance, the "look" command's >context might not be resolved to the current location as one might >reasonably expect assuming a missing direct object. It can be >finally resolved as "look Bubba" by picking up an object who's >methods insert entries into the user's context dictionary. >An interesting side effect for sure. We had discussed earlier the >prospect of players perverting other players namespaces. This brings >up the problem/ feature of objects and locations perverting a users >default context search in their command interface. Unfortunately I don't have the time right now to go research this directly, so I'll pick your brains instead... <kof> As I read this, it would only actually affect the parsing context when a verb was hit which had multiple possible resolutions. No? AFIAR ColdX uses the following parse order: character inventory room local objects (inventory of room) Do they make this decision of ambiguity (and resultant scan of the context dictionary) at each level of the tree, or only once the full tree has been traversed? What are the rules for defining and manipulating the context dictionary? >A key OO concept is blurred here. The distinction between class and >object instance. In Cold this has led to the $frob and what I would >call the prototype object or more properly the class descriptor >object. I've never liked ColdX's frob concept. It seems a real hack in an attempt to reverse bolt-on a coupound type. Yup, AlexO and I argued about this class/instance difference point for a long time back in the original CC: list. At that time I was talking the stance that there was no real need for a distinction between class objects and instances. Since then I've reversed -- mostly due to the fact that without the distinction management of state between classes, instances, and new instances can be a big problem. >For example there exists a $connection object which >contains all the methods and attributes necessary for handling a >socket connection. When a new connection is made a new object is >created that inherits $connection instead of an instance of >$connection. Instancing is can only be done through inheritance. This has some advantages in providing runtime morphism. The problem is see with ColdX is that they have taken this one idea and turned it into a hobby horse with which to solve all problems. There are some definite elegancies with instancing via inheritance, but there are also some big uglies. >The >inheritance tree depth can easily double and since methods can be >protected, private or public the "instanced" object is not >neccessarily like the object that spawned it (and attribute variables >also since the last release) Yup, this is a mess. I took one stab at introducing public/protected/private methods and inheritance and ran away screaming at the repercussions. I still have public and private methods, but that only affects their visability to external messages, not inheritance. >Now all of this is not necessarily a bad thing, but it does require a >significantly different approach to implementing an OO design than >other OOP languages. Agreed. I'm pretty solidly in the Cold camp at this point for the inheritance/class/instance design except tht I have formally seperated classes and instaces. The rest I'm still exmaining. -- J C Lawrence Internet: claw#null,net (Contractor) Internet: coder#ibm,net ---------------(*) Internet: clawrenc#cup,hp.com ...Honorary Member Clan McFUD -- Teamer's Avenging Monolith... </PRE> <!--X-Body-of-Message-End--> <!--X-MsgBody-End--> <!--X-Follow-Ups--> <HR> <!--X-Follow-Ups-End--> <!--X-References--> <UL><LI><STRONG>References</STRONG>: <UL> <LI><STRONG><A NAME="00254" HREF="msg00254.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></STRONG> <UL><LI><EM>From:</EM> "Jon A. Lambert" <jlsysinc#ix,netcom.com></LI></UL></LI> </UL></LI></UL> <!--X-References-End--> <!--X-BotPNI--> <UL> <LI>Prev by Date: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00286.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Magnetic Scrolls' magical parser</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Next by Date: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00288.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] (fwd) Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Prev by thread: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00254.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Next by thread: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00277.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Index(es): <UL> <LI><A HREF="index.html#00287"><STRONG>Date</STRONG></A></LI> <LI><A HREF="thread.html#00287"><STRONG>Thread</STRONG></A></LI> </UL> </LI> </UL> <!--X-BotPNI-End--> <!--X-User-Footer--> <!--X-User-Footer-End--> <ul><li>Thread context: <BLOCKQUOTE><UL> <LI><STRONG>Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM> <ul compact> <LI><strong><A NAME="00243" HREF="msg00243.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>, Jeff Kesselman <a href="mailto:jeffk#tenetwork,com">jeffk#tenetwork,com</a>, Sat 26 Apr 1997, 12:07 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00268" HREF="msg00268.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>, clawrenc <a href="mailto:clawrenc#cup,hp.com">clawrenc#cup,hp.com</a>, Tue 29 Apr 1997, 05:58 GMT </LI> </UL> </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00244" HREF="msg00244.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>, Jeff Kesselman <a href="mailto:jeffk#tenetwork,com">jeffk#tenetwork,com</a>, Sat 26 Apr 1997, 12:07 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00254" HREF="msg00254.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>, Jon A. Lambert <a href="mailto:jlsysinc#ix,netcom.com">jlsysinc#ix,netcom.com</a>, Sun 27 Apr 1997, 14:21 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00287" HREF="msg00287.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>, clawrenc <a href="mailto:clawrenc#cup,hp.com">clawrenc#cup,hp.com</a>, Wed 30 Apr 1997, 00:38 GMT </LI> </UL> </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00277" HREF="msg00277.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>, Jeff Kesselman <a href="mailto:jeffk#tenetwork,com">jeffk#tenetwork,com</a>, Tue 29 Apr 1997, 16:04 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00280" HREF="msg00280.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>, Jeff Kesselman <a href="mailto:jeffk#tenetwork,com">jeffk#tenetwork,com</a>, Tue 29 Apr 1997, 16:48 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00300" HREF="msg00300.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>, Jeff Kesselman <a href="mailto:jeffk#tenetwork,com">jeffk#tenetwork,com</a>, Wed 30 Apr 1997, 10:42 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00679" HREF="msg00679.html">Re: [MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list</A></strong>, Jeff Kesselman <a href="mailto:jeffk#tenetwork,com">jeffk#tenetwork,com</a>, Thu 22 May 1997, 01:25 GMT </LI> </ul> </LI> </UL></BLOCKQUOTE> </ul> <hr> <center> [ <a href="../">Other Periods</a> | <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a> | <a href="/search.php3">Search</a> ] </center> <hr> </body> </html>