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<H1>[MUD-Dev] Re: WIRED: Kilers have more fun</H1>
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<LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
<LI><em>Subject</em>: [MUD-Dev] Re: WIRED: Kilers have more fun </LI>
<LI><em>From</em>: <A HREF="mailto:Michael.Willey#abnamro,com">Michael.Willey#abnamro,com</A></LI>
<LI><em>Date</em>: Wed, 2 Sep 1998 10:04:13 -0500</LI>
<LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
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<PRE>
____________________Reply Separator____________________
Subject: [MUD-Dev] Re: WIRED: Kilers have more fun
Author: mud-dev#kanga,nu (J C Lawrence <claw#under,engr.sgi.com>)
Date: 9/1/98 8:02 PM
>On Fri, 24 Jul 1998 16:08:25 -0500
>Michael Willey<Michael.Willey#abnamro,com> wrote:
>
>> Theoretically, the point of a 'reputation system' is to
>> simulate people acquiring a reputation from the news and
>> rumors spread about their actions, right? It makes sense
>> to track information regarding their actions somehow in
>> order to simulate reactions from NPC characters, but why
>> do players need that crutch? Unlike NPCs, they have the
>> ability to listen to the rumor mill and make up their own
>> opinions.
>
>There are two reasons:
>
> 1) Players are not connected 24/7 and so don't have available
>the constant social feedback that defines a social context as
>well as "the word on the street". Tracking and publishing
>this sort of data doesn't solve this problem, but does lessen
>aspects of it.
That's only partially true - Joe Player is not connected 24/7,
but, given a large enough playerbase, *players* are. The
social feedback from the playerbase is not as omnipresent as
in RL, but it does exist. Tracking and publishing *data* may
increase it's effects, but creating *opinion* from data should
be the job of the player, not the computer. This seems to me
to be the primary failing of "reputation", "alignment", or
other behavior tracking systems.
>Earlier there was discussion of having descriptions and other
>generated output run thru a filter based on the experience
>line of the viewer. Thus descriptions would be tailored to
>what the player character had experienced and seen, to the
>level of some data being supressed and other data emphasized
>due to the altered levels of importance that pertained to that
>specific character (eg warriors would notice battle scars and
>the states of weapons, tailors would notice the material used
>in clothing and details of its repair, etc).
>Thus each character would see something potentially different
>from what any other character saw of the same item, ad this
>in turn would be guaranteed different from what that character
>saw of himself.
Exactly! Consider Bubba and Buffy, the Duo-Bombers. They
randomly kill people and destroy property to advance some
political movement. By any conventional measure of morals,
they're dangerous felons. If their identities are well-known,
then their reputation will reflect that. But if Buffy checks
the reputation of Bubba, why would she see him as dangerous?
To her he's a hero struggling for 'the cause'. Boffo supports
their movement, but thinks that bombings aren't the way to
achieve their goals. In Boffo's view, they're merely misguided.
Biff lost a family member to one of these bombs. He doesn't
care about politics, but he thinks Bubba and Buffy are evil
incarnate.
I think, however, that the only filter complex enough to
adequately process all these factors into an opinion exists
inside a player's head. I would say that the solution lies
in assisting that filter by providing it with better data,
not in creating a new filter.
</PRE>
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<ul><li>Thread context:
<BLOCKQUOTE><UL>
<LI><STRONG>[MUD-Dev] Re: WIRED: Kilers have more fun</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM>
<ul compact>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00413" HREF="msg00413.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: WIRED: Kilers have more fun</A></strong>,
quzah <a href="mailto:quzah#geocities,com">quzah#geocities,com</a>, Wed 29 Jul 1998, 04:31 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00737" HREF="msg00737.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: WIRED: Kilers have more fun</A></strong>,
Matt Chatterley <a href="mailto:matt#mpc,dyn.ml.org">matt#mpc,dyn.ml.org</a>, Sat 15 Aug 1998, 17:40 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00760" HREF="msg00760.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: WIRED: Kilers have more fun</A></strong>,
Damion Schubert <a href="mailto:zjiria#texas,net">zjiria#texas,net</a>, Tue 18 Aug 1998, 05:11 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00763" HREF="msg00763.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: WIRED: Kilers have more fun</A></strong>,
Damion Schubert <a href="mailto:zjiria#texas,net">zjiria#texas,net</a>, Tue 18 Aug 1998, 06:36 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00905" HREF="msg00905.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: WIRED: Kilers have more fun</A></strong>,
Michael.Willey <a href="mailto:Michael.Willey#abnamro,com">Michael.Willey#abnamro,com</a>, Wed 02 Sep 1998, 14:03 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00906" HREF="msg00906.html">[MUD-Dev] Equipment Fit</A></strong>,
Holly Sommer <a href="mailto:hsommer#micro,ti.com">hsommer#micro,ti.com</a>, Wed 02 Sep 1998, 14:26 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00908" HREF="msg00908.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Equipment Fit</A></strong>,
Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt <a href="mailto:hhs#cbs,dtu.dk">hhs#cbs,dtu.dk</a>, Wed 02 Sep 1998, 15:09 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00909" HREF="msg00909.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Equipment Fit</A></strong>,
pomales <a href="mailto:pomales#caip,rutgers.edu">pomales#caip,rutgers.edu</a>, Wed 02 Sep 1998, 15:28 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00967" HREF="msg00967.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Equipment Fit</A></strong>,
Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt <a href="mailto:hhs#cbs,dtu.dk">hhs#cbs,dtu.dk</a>, Sun 06 Sep 1998, 14:31 GMT
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