<!-- MHonArc v2.4.4 --> <!--X-Subject: [MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc) --> <!--X-From-R13: "Ybfgre, Dncu" <exbfgreNbevtva.rn.pbz> --> <!--X-Date: Fri, 4 May 1998 06:39:11 -0700 --> <!--X-Message-Id: c=US%a=_%p=EA%l=MOLACH-980504200737Z-93531#molach,origin.ea.com --> <!--X-Content-Type: text/plain --> <!--X-Head-End--> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"> <html> <head> <title>MUD-Dev message, [MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Pla</title> <!-- meta name="robots" content="noindex,nofollow" --> <link rev="made" href="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com"> </head> <body background="/backgrounds/paperback.gif" bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000" link="#0000FF" alink="#FF0000" vlink="#006000"> <font size="+4" color="#804040"> <strong><em>MUD-Dev<br>mailing list archive</em></strong> </font> <br> [ <a href="../">Other Periods</a> | <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a> | <a href="/search.php3">Search</a> ] <br clear=all><hr> <!--X-Body-Begin--> <!--X-User-Header--> <!--X-User-Header-End--> <!--X-TopPNI--> Date: [ <a href="msg00370.html">Previous</a> | <a href="msg00372.html">Next</a> ] Thread: [ <a href="msg00367.html">Previous</a> | <a href="msg00397.html">Next</a> ] Index: [ <A HREF="author.html#00371">Author</A> | <A HREF="#00371">Date</A> | <A HREF="thread.html#00371">Thread</A> ] <!--X-TopPNI-End--> <!--X-MsgBody--> <!--X-Subject-Header-Begin--> <H1>[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</H1> <HR> <!--X-Subject-Header-End--> <!--X-Head-of-Message--> <UL> <LI><em>To</em>: "'<A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A>'" <<A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A>></LI> <LI><em>Subject</em>: [MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</LI> <LI><em>From</em>: "Koster, Raph" <<A HREF="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com">rkoster#origin,ea.com</A>></LI> <LI><em>Date</em>: Mon, 4 May 1998 15:07:37 -0500</LI> <LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI> <LI><em>Sender</em>: "Petidomo List Agent -- Kanga.Nu version" <<A HREF="mailto:petidomo#kanga,nu">petidomo#kanga,nu</A>></LI> </UL> <!--X-Head-of-Message-End--> <!--X-Head-Body-Sep-Begin--> <HR> <!--X-Head-Body-Sep-End--> <!--X-Body-of-Message--> <PRE> On Monday, May 04, 1998 3:32 PM Marian Griffith [SMTP:gryphon#iaehv,nl] wrote: >Raph said: > > Most muds, even those oriented towards play spaces, haven't tended to > > give a very wide scope for play. The most complete play spaces, such > > as MUSHes, have such a high barrier of entry for true "play" ("let's > > make TinyTim's clock!" "Sure! Let me just pull up my custom softcode > > editor with integrated debugger!") that they are self-limiting... > Actually I have to disagree with this. PernMush (being the mush I am > most familiar with) and other similarly themed mushes actually have a > very low entry level. For roleplay, yes? But a very high set of barriers, as I recall, before you can do any building (which is also play). (It's been a while since I visited PernMUSH, so I could be out of date). > And what barrier there isn't a thing to do with > code and everything with getting to know people. I have become very > good at volunteering other people to help me with the little coding I > needed, but then I am famous for being unable even to program the VCR > so perhaps I am excused from any coding chores by my friends ;) What I was referring to was giving the *full scope* of play--so, if most people are satisfied by just the roleplay, great... but the building/softcode part of the play that MUSH code offers is usually restricted--and it's a form of play that is very appealing. (In fact, it was the ONLY form of play Alphaworld really offered beyond talking). It's worth noting that the roleplay part of a mud isn't really a mud feature, because you don't need a mud to do it. The mud merely offers a context. The avenues for play the mud offers are actually its communications capabilities and its building capabilities. > And here you may run into > the gender bias that you mentioned at the beginning of your post. If > I am excused to be overly generalistic. The young males generally en- > joy the competitive game oriented games over the play oriented ones. > And the women who would prefer the play oriented games are not found > in as great numbers on the internet looking for games. Gender differences are very real in terms of audience... I wouldn't be surprised to hear that Dr Cat's project has a huge proportion of female players. > Perhaps if you > broaden your definition of 'game' to include talkers you arrive at a > significantly different distribution between the two types of game. By Bettelheim's definition, a talker would indeed be "play." -Raph -- MUD-Dev: Advancing an unrealised future. </PRE> <!--X-Body-of-Message-End--> <!--X-MsgBody-End--> <!--X-Follow-Ups--> <HR> <ul compact><li><strong>Follow-Ups</strong>: <ul> <li><strong><A NAME="00397" HREF="msg00397.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong> <ul compact><li><em>From:</em> "Dr. Cat" <cat#bga,com></li></ul> </UL></LI></UL> <!--X-Follow-Ups-End--> <!--X-References--> <!--X-References-End--> <!--X-BotPNI--> <UL> <LI>Prev by Date: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00370.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Some thoughts on languages and users - was: Ma</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Next by Date: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00372.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) AD: [custom graphical] whitestar Crossfire MUD</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Prev by thread: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00367.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Next by thread: <STRONG><A HREF="msg00397.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></STRONG> </LI> <LI>Index(es): <UL> <LI><A HREF="index.html#00371"><STRONG>Date</STRONG></A></LI> <LI><A HREF="thread.html#00371"><STRONG>Thread</STRONG></A></LI> </UL> </LI> </UL> <!--X-BotPNI-End--> <!--X-User-Footer--> <!--X-User-Footer-End--> <ul><li>Thread context: <BLOCKQUOTE><UL> <LI><STRONG>[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM> <ul compact> <LI><strong><A NAME="00368" HREF="msg00368.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>, Adam Wiggins <a href="mailto:adam#angel,com">adam#angel,com</a>, Mon 04 May 1998, 13:23 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00429" HREF="msg00429.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>, J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Wed 06 May 1998, 18:57 GMT </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00356" HREF="msg00356.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>, Koster, Raph <a href="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com">rkoster#origin,ea.com</a>, Mon 04 May 1998, 08:29 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00367" HREF="msg00367.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>, Marian Griffith <a href="mailto:gryphon#iaehv,nl">gryphon#iaehv,nl</a>, Mon 04 May 1998, 13:14 GMT </LI> </UL> </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00371" HREF="msg00371.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>, Koster, Raph <a href="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com">rkoster#origin,ea.com</a>, Mon 04 May 1998, 13:39 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00397" HREF="msg00397.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>, Dr. Cat <a href="mailto:cat#bga,com">cat#bga,com</a>, Tue 05 May 1998, 14:00 GMT <UL> <LI><strong><A NAME="00400" HREF="msg00400.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>, Adam Wiggins <a href="mailto:adam#angel,com">adam#angel,com</a>, Tue 05 May 1998, 15:21 GMT </LI> </UL> </LI> </UL> </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00416" HREF="msg00416.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>, Chris Gray <a href="mailto:cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA">cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA</a>, Wed 06 May 1998, 05:33 GMT </LI> </ul> </LI> <LI><strong><A NAME="00297" HREF="msg00297.html">[MUD-Dev] Monthly FAQ Posting</A></strong>, Ling <a href="mailto:K.L.Lo-94#student,lboro.ac.uk">K.L.Lo-94#student,lboro.ac.uk</a>, Fri 01 May 1998, 17:11 GMT </UL></BLOCKQUOTE> </ul> <hr> <center> [ <a href="../">Other Periods</a> | <a href="../../">Other mailing lists</a> | <a href="/search.php3">Search</a> ] </center> <hr> </body> </html>