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<H1>[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</H1>
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<LI><em>To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
<LI><em>Subject</em>: [MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc) </LI>
<LI><em>From</em>: J C Lawrence <<A HREF="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</A>></LI>
<LI><em>Date</em>: Wed, 06 May 1998 11:56:22 -0700</LI>
<LI><em>Reply-To</em>: <A HREF="mailto:mud-dev#kanga,nu">mud-dev#kanga,nu</A></LI>
<LI><em>Sender</em>: "Petidomo List Agent -- Kanga.Nu version" <<A HREF="mailto:petidomo#kanga,nu">petidomo#kanga,nu</A>></LI>
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<PRE>
On Sat, 2 May 98 10:03:57 MST
Chris Gray<cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA> wrote:
> [JC Lawrence:]
>> I would note that any competitive game which involves the concept
>> of "beating" another player is actually a variation on the
>> "killing" games, just with a prettier face drawn over the gore via
>> poker chips or property cards etc. This suggests that the
>> deliniation among games on this point is specious, or at best
>> artificial.
> OK, I'll bite. A difference you are paving over here is that of what
> is left after the different kinds of competition.
Nope. That's a scalar factor, not a critical difference.
> In a game where the goal is to defeat (avoiding the perhaps loaded
> term 'beat') other players at some task such as property management,
> risk management, economic fore- casting, etc., both players are
> still around at the end of the game. In fact, both players may well
> be improved by the game in that they now are better at whatever the
> game involved. In a game where the goal is to kill the other player,
> one of the player's (in the game context) is gone after the game is
> done. Hence, there is likely to be a significant net loss in
> available resources after the game is over. So, I think painting all
> competitive games with the same brush is unwarrented.
The scale is in the differential between the two players after the
contest. One result may that both players are better off than they
were before the contest, but that one has attained a higher state than
the other (ignoring problems with positive feedback loops). Another
possible result is that one player no longer exists, and the other is
variously either better off or worse off than he was before.
There are many possible gradations between. That's why its a scalar,
and not a principle factor.
--
J C Lawrence Internet: claw#null,net
(Contractor) Internet: coder#ibm,net
---------(*) Internet: claw#under,engr.sgi.com
...Honourary Member of Clan McFud -- Teamer's Avenging Monolith...
--
MUD-Dev: Advancing an unrealised future.
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<LI><STRONG><A NAME="00329" HREF="msg00329.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></STRONG>
<UL><LI><EM>From:</EM> cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA (Chris Gray)</LI></UL></LI>
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<ul><li>Thread context:
<BLOCKQUOTE><UL>
<LI><STRONG>[MUD-Dev] Re: Some thoughts on languages and users - was: Ma</STRONG>, <EM>(continued)</EM>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<ul compact>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00508" HREF="msg00508.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Some thoughts on languages and users - was: Ma</A></strong>,
J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Mon 11 May 1998, 22:53 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
</ul>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00417" HREF="msg00417.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: Some thoughts on languages and users - was: Ma</A></strong>,
Chris Gray <a href="mailto:cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA">cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA</a>, Wed 06 May 1998, 05:33 GMT
</LI>
</ul>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00329" HREF="msg00329.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>,
Chris Gray <a href="mailto:cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA">cg#ami-cg,GraySage.Edmonton.AB.CA</a>, Sat 02 May 1998, 17:17 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00368" HREF="msg00368.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>,
Adam Wiggins <a href="mailto:adam#angel,com">adam#angel,com</a>, Mon 04 May 1998, 13:23 GMT
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00429" HREF="msg00429.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>,
J C Lawrence <a href="mailto:claw#under,engr.sgi.com">claw#under,engr.sgi.com</a>, Wed 06 May 1998, 18:57 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
<UL>
<li><Possible follow-up(s)><br>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00356" HREF="msg00356.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>,
Koster, Raph <a href="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com">rkoster#origin,ea.com</a>, Mon 04 May 1998, 08:29 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00367" HREF="msg00367.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>,
Marian Griffith <a href="mailto:gryphon#iaehv,nl">gryphon#iaehv,nl</a>, Mon 04 May 1998, 13:14 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00371" HREF="msg00371.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>,
Koster, Raph <a href="mailto:rkoster#origin,ea.com">rkoster#origin,ea.com</a>, Mon 04 May 1998, 13:39 GMT
<UL>
<LI><strong><A NAME="00397" HREF="msg00397.html">[MUD-Dev] Re: (fwd) Re: POLL: Games ruined by bad players (Player killers, tank rushers etc)</A></strong>,
Dr. Cat <a href="mailto:cat#bga,com">cat#bga,com</a>, Tue 05 May 1998, 14:00 GMT
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
</UL>
</LI>
</UL></BLOCKQUOTE>
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